Coming of Age

Southern Conference Champions - 2003, 2007, 2010, 2012
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Coming of Age

Postby lawdog on Thu Oct 06, 2016 1:55 pm

Not the only one doing it this year, I think. Leadership. http://www.goupstate.com/sports/2016100 ... or-wofford
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Re: Coming of Age

Postby Eyes of Old Main on Thu Oct 06, 2016 10:30 pm

Opponents should beware of teams that play with the heart of a Terrier.
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Re: Coming of Age

Postby youngterrier on Thu Oct 06, 2016 10:59 pm

Between having probably the two biggest DL (if I remember correctly, last year was the first time we had a freshman DL at 300 lbs and we have another one this year), Tyler Vaughn, a deep linebacking corp, and a pass defense that is quantifiably better than years past on top of hearing these stories about player and personal development, I really do think our defense is stellar this year.

We're gonna make some noise this year, the more observe, the better I feel. We lost to Samford, yeah but it was close.

Look out Western.
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Re: Coming of Age

Postby WTFan on Fri Oct 07, 2016 8:17 am

"A pass defense that is quantifyingly better than years past" gave up 28 receptions on 32 attempts last week. I respectively disagree.
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Re: Coming of Age

Postby youngterrier on Fri Oct 07, 2016 11:53 am

WTFan wrote:"A pass defense that is quantifyingly better than years past" gave up 28 receptions on 32 attempts last week. I respectively disagree.


Your sample size is too small
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Re: Coming of Age

Postby youngterrier on Fri Oct 07, 2016 12:21 pm

All you need to know about our pass defense so far: Samford is a top 10 pass offense and has maintained those numbers in spite of playing top statistical pass defenses such as us, Central Arkansas and Chattanooga.

It's true that we've only played 5 games and only so many stats remain consistent, but Samford and Western and VMI are probably going to pass it more than any other teams we play, while everyone else (particularly the Citadel, Furman and Chattanooga) are going to emphasize the run game.

So far this season, our defense gives up about 188 yards a game (though I'll admit we'll have a better idea of them for statistical purposes after this week). Compare that to:
2015: 222 ypg
2014: 232 ypg
2013: 220 ypg*
2012: 180 ypg*
2011: 176 ypg*

*in 2011-2013 we played Georgia Southern, and I think in 2011 the Citadel started running the option.

I could probably go more in depth, but stats can only tell us so much (for instance, one busted play against TT was the difference between us matching last year's performance, which is quite a feat considering they are passing it more this year
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Re: Coming of Age

Postby 19TERRIER19 on Fri Oct 07, 2016 4:15 pm

2nd in the Nation in Total Defense and 2nd in the nation in scoring defense while playing Sammy and Ole Miss on the first half of the schedule. I think its safe to say that we have a really good defense.
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Re: Coming of Age

Postby walliver on Fri Oct 07, 2016 4:29 pm

WTFan wrote:"A pass defense that is quantifyingly better than years past" gave up 28 receptions on 32 attempts last week. I respectively disagree.


But only a handful of those completions were big gainers. Many of them were for little to no gain, and some for a loss.
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Re: Coming of Age

Postby WTFan on Fri Oct 07, 2016 9:32 pm

Doesn't matter. They scored 28 pts. You can't be a playoff FCS team when a team can throw the ball against you at will. Same old Achilles heal. I was simply pointing out that out pass defense is not "quantifylingly better than it has been in recent years". It isn't. Plain and simple. Overall defensively we have improved from last season but our pass defense has been atrocious for the last several years. Not a nock on the players necessarily but on the overall scheme and philosophy. Why are we always, always the team you can just throw it all over the yard against? It can change but seems like there is a resistance to change. Just like there is a resistance to the play calling philosophy we've had for far too long.
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Re: Coming of Age

Postby Eyes of Old Main on Fri Oct 07, 2016 9:57 pm

Our run defense is excellent and we have more talent and depth than we've had in a long time, if ever. We lost a key piece of our LB corp and haven't missed a beat. We have talented pass defenders, but in the case of last weekend's game, I think our coaches schemed for a bend but don't break style. Samford got a few big pass plays, and some of those were on missed assignments, but for the most part, they were shorter passes. I'm not saying there aren't issues to work on, but I don't want to criticize players for doing what they are told by the coaches. If that means criticizing the coaches, then I am OK with that if it is warranted, but in the end, our defensive unit (coaches and players) turned an almost one dimensional offense into a truly one dimensional offense and kept them below their averages. If Wofford avoids the penalties (ranging from phantom to bonehead) then they win that game.

As far as Western goes, they seem to be like Samford offensively (pass oriented), but their defense seems to be weaker. Cullowhee hasn't been the easiest place for Wofford recently, but this has the feel of a big day running the football to me. Whether Wofford can slow them down offensively will dictate the game because I don't think they will be able to keep our backs down all day. We will see, but I look for a strong performance and good win from Wofford tomorrow.
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Re: Coming of Age

Postby youngterrier on Fri Oct 07, 2016 10:28 pm

I would say "I can't think of an example of a championship caliber defense in the FCS that allowed over 300 yards passing and a lot of point scored on it"

but then there's this

http://www.espn.com/college-football/ma ... =400869736

It's a basic impulse to say our defense is trash whenever the other team passes for a first down or a big play. It's not realistic to expect any team to win every play, to not allow points, big plays on occasion, and so on. What you can do, is average or aggregate overall performances and attribute a sort of probability as to what to expect.

If you look at how we played as playoff teams in 2011 and 2012
(links: http://woffordterriers.com/cumestats.as ... &year=2011
http://athletics.wofford.edu/cumestats. ... r=2012%20& )

Elon always and occasionally Western Carolina passed for over 300 yards against us. We beat them regularly and our overall pass defense was solid for those years (the strength of the team in 2012). 315 yards to an air raid offense isn't stupendous but it's also not terrible either. It obviously remains to be seen how good Samford is but there's an indication that they are decent. The 300 yards passing as an indicator for us having a bad defense is kind of like saying in basketball, because we let a team like VMI score 80 our defense isn't good (even when they average well over 100)

Meanwhile, if you look at the stats of us in 2015, we allowed 4 teams to throw for 300 yards on us, with another 2 at 249 or more

If you look at 2014, we allowed 3 teams to throw over 300 yards on us and another 3 thew for 249 or more

Or you can compare it to the 2013 where we had 3 teams throw for 300 yards and another 3 threw for 249 or more.

My point is, so far we've allowed one 300 yard game, 2 games of less than 100 yards, and another 2 games in the low 200s. The season is almost halfway over and WCU and VMI are the only remaining teams that will throw it a lot relative to passing (even then, WCU might not) and I can say with confidence that Samford is better than both of them.

And I don't say all of this to throw stats out or to be pretentious, but I say this because quite frankly I don't like the impulsive boo-hiss "woe-is-me" attitude that comes from this board in the wake of a bad week. Our players work their butts off and the coaches are underpaid but still put out a great, competitive product. We've had a couple rough years, that's true, and there are reasons why that is. The least we can do, is give credit where credit is due, and I sincerely believe we're a better football team this year.

And I could be wrong about all of this (!), WCU may throw it around the yard and we look foolish and lose Saturday. But even if we let them complete some passes and get some yardage that doesn't mean we're a bad defensive or bad pass defensive football team. It just means they like to pass and they'll get their yards. How many times have we played an absolutely terrible offensive football game and still run for 250-300 yards? The same principle applies with passing football teams.

Criticism is good, but when it's statistically an anomaly (like, if we threw for 300 yards in a game) or anticipated (option teams will get run yardage, air raids will get pass yardage), there's really no purpose in it. It's not like the coaches read this board anyway. We might as well just be supportive, give credit where it's due, and if we're going to be angry in our criticism, have facts to back it up.
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Re: Coming of Age

Postby 19TERRIER19 on Sat Oct 08, 2016 7:47 am

Outside of giving up a ridiculous short field for a score, (not the players fault). We gave up 3 scores to Sammy. Ur pass defense isn't piteous by any means. And we got off the field a ton against Sammy, we just didn't put that additional score we needed. Sammy completing screen after screen inflated the completion number and percentage. At the end of the day, they passed for less then their averages and scored less points. And that factors in a silly short field that the coaches placed them in. Against a pass HAPPY offense that's not ridiculous. They held up strong and I feel it's a great team defense. Pass or run. Most teams have some semblance of trying to run.
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